Exegesis V07 Issue 079

Exegesis Volume 07 Issue #079

In This Issue:

From: Patrice Guinard
Subject: [e] Re: exegesis Digest V7 #78

From: Patrice Guinard
Subject: [e] Sophisticated modern astrology

From: "Jan Sar"
Subject: [e] Re: exegesis Digest V7 #78

Exegesis Digest Tue, 10 Sep 2002

Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 11:01:55 +0200
From: Patrice Guinard
Subject: [e] Re: exegesis Digest V7 #78

> >From: Exegesis Moderator
> >Subject: [e] Re: Horary doubts and Questions
> >
> >Patrice Guinard wrote (in 7:75):
> >>>Divination is a funny business, best not to worry too
> >>>much about it and try to use a light touch.
> >>Divinatory is a puerile and a futile practice of astrology.
> >
> >Well, Patrice, that statement is ONLY opinion and
> >contains no content other than opinion.

> >If horary is so trivial then dismissing it by use of
> >logical argument should be easy. I'm listening.

I'm not going to repeat here all what I've written at CURA. It seems to me that I've provided here (Exegesis) some arguments in the past in favour of my "opinion". Sorry if it can't be understood. My chief idea is that a PHYSICS, a BIOLOGY, that could underlie, if one!, would only be compatible with natal & mundane astrology, not horary.

> >From Jan Sar
> >Midpoints are basic combinations of any 3 planets or points where one is in
> >the center between two others. There is a common misunderstanding about the
> >nature of midpoints. They are not just some extra, additional placements on
> >the chart. To the contrary, they don’t change components, THEY ENHANCE
> >THEIR MEANING.
> >
> >etc ...
> >

We all know this, Jan. Mid-points are another manner to use aspects, a kind of substitute. The problem is there is no definite MEANINGS in astrology. And astrologers are just believing it. Have a look at the Ebertin cookbook, "The combination of stellar influences": nothing else in the "interpretations" that were not known by classical aspects.

> >From: L:Smerillo
> >Patrice,
> >rather the burden is upon you to provide a rationale for not using
> >midpoints, which are a direct result of the Axel Harvey Mathemetical
> >Formula of Astrological Functions.

Well, if a mathematical formula could prove astrology, it would be known outside of the astrological milieu. No?
Thanks for the burden, but I have others.

> >For the rest, I do not think that the
> >complexity of the local world is to be reduced merely to some
> >psychological topoi, which in themselves are merely cultural artefacts.

I haven't said "psychological" (which are as you say cultural artefacts), but psychic. See (at CURA) my Aphorisms upon Astrology.

Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 11:19:40 +0200
From: Patrice Guinard
Subject: [e] Sophisticated modern astrology

> >rather the burden is upon you to provide a rationale for not using
> >midpoints

The "primitive" people were doing more, & more essentially, with just Sun & Moon, than the modern astrologers with all their sophisticated methods & material.

From: "Jan Sar"
Subject: [e] Re: exegesis Digest V7 #78
Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 01:52:30 +0000

> >From Jan – Sar (Skapski) I wasn’t my intention to write about the legacy of Dorotheus, it must be my transits! You may as well, have here one more (or one too many) the opinion about horary. (i am using capitol letters in a place of bold text)

In the many years of my involvement in astrology, as a personal consultant, a teacher, in my own area of investigation, or simply from curiosity… it was impossible not to come upon the subject of the horary. And when a student asks me a question, I cannot dismiss this simply by saying, “Sit down, don’t ask stupid questions and eat your porridge.” Is this astrology form of “a art,” a divination? Sorry, but I disregard the whole matter of divination the same way I wouldn’t mix medicine with witchcraft – both methods may work, but they belong neither to astrology nor to medicine. Then what? - Maybe what I am writing may give you some answer. It was once upon a time, during the Roman Empire (maybe someone could give me an exact period of time when this was practiced?), that during Moon Void of Course all government offices were closed, because “nothing anyway would come out well from all subjects.” In our present days we have trains going on schedule, airplanes are flying, busses are on time regardless of the phase of a Moon or any other horary restrictions. Sure, if someone will start to investigate, there is always the probability, that some of the mishaps or irregularities could fall in the time of VC. Then comes the obvious question: WHAT IF TRANSITING PLANETS ARE FORMING AN ASPECT TO THE PERSONAL HOROSCOPE THAT CONTRADICTS A HORARY STATEMENT? - At the same time it happens that many events are difficult to pin down to any particular influence of this or the other planet… There was a time in my practice, that I was taking a part in, so-called, “Psychic Fairs.” Without going into details of “how and why” I got involved in such activities, summing up, this was a unique experience. People were coming in waves often separated by an hour or two of an uneventful temporary “intermission.” A surge of clients resembled a sort of marathon together with a “high wire act.” I had to squeeze a whole horoscope in the 15 – 20 minutes reading trying to find and concentrate on the most relevant, most important matter. It was then that in one moment, following the third or fourth person I realized that …I AM REPEATING MYSELF! I experienced in an instant a chilling feeling (similar to the one experienced by every astrologer, once in his/her practice, while finding out that he/she is giving a correct reading from a “wrong horoscope”). Next, I started to investigate: IF ALL THE READINGS ARE CORRECT, THEN WHAT IS THE MATTER? - I got the idea to set up an event chart for the time of readings …and here was the answer: THE EVENT CHART WAS IN MANY WAYS CORRESPONDING WITH THE SUBJECTS THAT WERE DISCUSSED! Next day I was prepared with a set of charts, two hours apart, calculated for the whole day. Should I say, that from this day I am always looking at the appointment chart as well as the original horoscope? (not following any horary directives!). - To this day I am finding few exceptions to this “rule.” We often neglect to take into consideration what is, as I prefer to call it, “a planetary weather.” THIS KIND OF CHART WILL NEVER SUBSTITUTE THE PERSONAL HOROSCOPE, but in many cases could be very helpful. This will even work out more often if we deal with people who are impulsive, a subject to strong emotional influence, people who are ‘simple’ in some respect, people with undeveloped self-consciousness, those restricted in their individual development… Looking into the past THIS WAS IN FACT THE PREVAILING ENVIRONMENT. And we don’t even have to look into the past to see how under extreme conditions, people are guided mainly by their instinctive impulses and instinct of self-preservation. We may only ask if this was the basis for horary astrology? Perhaps this kind of chart may still have some application inside a very specific cultural environment. THE CONCEPT OF HORARY GOES TOGETHER WITH A VERY SIMILAR IN ORIGIN, NOTION OF HOUSES. At present, and within the intellectually advanced society, I can’t see a use for either one. All the above was written during Moon VC…

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